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  • SBS Services With UPS and Backup/Restore

    We just installed a new 2008 SBS at one of my client's locations. At this time, the client is only using the server as a file server, to access a ISYS DB case management program, print services, Domain services, WSUS and DHCP/DNS. We recently installed a new APC UPS, but only have the basic agent installed, which to my knowledge will only gracefully shutdown the OS. According to the APC web site, the deluxe version of the PowerChute software is needed to gracefully stop services such as Exchange, SharePoint, SQL, etc. Herein lies the question:

    Since my client is not using Exchange, or Sharepoint, etc. Can I just disable those services on the server, so they aren't messed up if the power and battery fails requiring a shutdown of the server? If so, which services need to be disabled to ensure Exchange, Sharepoint, etc. are not running and are safe from a power outage shutdown?

    Also, will turning off those service affect my Windows Server Backups? I remember when disabling Exchange on their old server, NTBACKUP threw errors each night stating it was unable to backup Exchange without the Info Store service, etc. running. Will this cause issues with my nightly backups? With that being said, would there be any foreseeable issues restoring the server both application wise and bare-metal?

    Should we just buck up and pay for the license upgrade, or would disabling the services make more sense? Thanks in advance for your advice!

    Derek

  • #2
    Re: SBS Services With UPS and Backup/Restore

    My answer is neither!
    The basic software gives you the option of running a command file. I put commands in the file which stop the services and let the software gracefully power down the server - just give it enough run time.

    eg: net stop msexchangesa /y
    is a command which gracefully closes Exchange
    TIA

    Steven Teiger [SBS-MVP(2003-2009)]
    http://www.wintra.co.il/
    sigpic
    Iím honoured to have been selected for the SMB 150 list for 2013. This is the third time in succession (no logo available for 2011) that I have been honoured with this award.

    We donít stop playing because we grow old, we grow old because we stop playing.

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    • #3
      Re: SBS Services With UPS and Backup/Restore

      I think APC is full of bunk. If the OS gracefully shuts down, it takes care of shutting down applications and services. What do you think happens when you restart or shut down your server from the Start button? The applications and services don't just crash, they are shut down gracefully by the OS.

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      • #4
        Re: SBS Services With UPS and Backup/Restore

        Guys, thanks for the responses. Apparently my instant notification isn't working, so I'll have to check on that...

        So I have one vote that it doesn't need anything extra. If the OS gracefully shuts down, then there's no need to terminate services ahead of time. However, how exactly does the OS shutdown? Does it happen with shutdown.exe where the window pops up that counts down to shutdown and is this the same shutdown process as a normal start menu shutdown? Does this pose additional concerns that a "regular" shutdown does not? I just want to be sure their software is protected.

        The other suggestion is to run a command file to shutdown the other services. If this is indeed needed, how do I create such a command file for all of the services on SBS that need to be shut down properly? I guess I am not sure which services should be shutdown prior to the server shutting down in this circumstance. I also am not sure which commands will shutdown the needed services. Any additional, specific help you can provide would be appreciated!

        Please advise, guys and thanks a lot!

        Derek
        Last edited by RaeKWoNCHeF; 12th February 2010, 22:38.

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        • #5
          Re: SBS Services With UPS and Backup/Restore

          Why not do a manual shutdown and time how long it takes. Then add a 2, 3 or 5 minute fiddle factor to the time and set the APC software to shutdown making sure there is enough time so the UPS battery doesn't run out of juice and your shutdown turns dirty.

          Personally on all my Servers and workstations I have them set to shutdown if the mains power is off for 5 minutes. I figure if it is off for 5 minutes then it is likely to be off for some time.
          1 1 was a racehorse.
          2 2 was 1 2.
          1 1 1 1 race 1 day,
          2 2 1 1 2

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          • #6
            Re: SBS Services With UPS and Backup/Restore

            Originally posted by biggles77 View Post
            Why not do a manual shutdown and time how long it takes. Then add a 2, 3 or 5 minute fiddle factor to the time and set the APC software to shutdown making sure there is enough time so the UPS battery doesn't run out of juice and your shutdown turns dirty.

            Personally on all my Servers and workstations I have them set to shutdown if the mains power is off for 5 minutes. I figure if it is off for 5 minutes then it is likely to be off for some time.
            Thanks for the response. I am not so much worried about the battery running out of juice before the server shuts down as I am with the server shutting down, but not letting the services gracefully shutdown before the OS does. According to APC, this can be a problem. With that being said, I'd love to build a command file to shut down all services before shutting down the server as was suggested in a earlier post, but I am not sure how to accomplish this with all of the SBS services that need to be protected. If anyone can give me specifics for the command file, or point me to a resource that shows what services I need to terminate and how, in a command file, I'd be greatly appreciative. Thanks in advance.

            Derek

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            • #7
              Re: SBS Services With UPS and Backup/Restore

              Put this command in a btach file and get APC to run it when its been on battery for more than 5 mins

              shutdown -s -f -c "On battery for more than 5 mins"

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              • #8
                Re: SBS Services With UPS and Backup/Restore

                Originally posted by wullieb1 View Post
                Put this command in a btach file and get APC to run it when its been on battery for more than 5 mins

                shutdown -s -f -c "On battery for more than 5 mins"
                What does this do? I don;t see any services being killed? No responses from the other parties that originally responded to the initial post? Help, guys! Thanks in advance!

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                • #9
                  Re: SBS Services With UPS and Backup/Restore

                  is a wonderful self help tool. http://www.lmgtfy.com/?q=command+line+to+stop+exchange

                  http://www.lmgtfy.com/?q=shutdown+switches
                  or
                  http://www.lmgtfy.com/?q=command+line+shutdown+switches

                  Lots of educational reading there for you.
                  1 1 was a racehorse.
                  2 2 was 1 2.
                  1 1 1 1 race 1 day,
                  2 2 1 1 2

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                  • #10
                    Re: SBS Services With UPS and Backup/Restore

                    I hate to be a wonk, but both versions have the capability to perform a graceful shutdown of the operating system. When the operating system is gracefully shutdown, it gracefully shuts down all running services, including the services of Exchange, SQL, etc. Nothing more is needed. APC is trying to sell you something you don't need by giving you a line of bunk. I've used both versions for the last decade and I can tell you that when the APC software shuts down the server, it is in fact a graceful shutdown of the OS and all running applications, services, etc. The fact that the Deluxe version states that it will perform a graceful shutdown of applications is meaningless and is a red herring as a graceful shutdown of the OS accomplishes the same thing.

                    Please don't take this personally as I mean no offense. I know you're trying to be dilligent and I commend your attitude but you've spent entirely too long debating the issue. You need nothing more than the basic software from APC. You don't need batch files, powershell scripts, deluxe versions, or anything else.

                    http://www.apcmedia.com/salestools/T...THN9_R0_EN.pdf

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                    • #11
                      Re: SBS Services With UPS and Backup/Restore

                      Originally posted by joeqwerty View Post
                      I hate to be a wonk, but both versions have the capability to perform a graceful shutdown of the operating system. When the operating system is gracefully shutdown, it gracefully shuts down all running services, including the services of Exchange, SQL, etc. Nothing more is needed. APC is trying to sell you something you don't need by giving you a line of bunk. I've used both versions for the last decade and I can tell you that when the APC software shuts down the server, it is in fact a graceful shutdown of the OS and all running applications, services, etc. The fact that the Deluxe version states that it will perform a graceful shutdown of applications is meaningless and is a red herring as a graceful shutdown of the OS accomplishes the same thing.

                      Please don't take this personally as I mean no offense. I know you're trying to be dilligent and I commend your attitude but you've spent entirely too long debating the issue. You need nothing more than the basic software from APC. You don't need batch files, powershell scripts, deluxe versions, or anything else.

                      http://www.apcmedia.com/salestools/T...THN9_R0_EN.pdf
                      Thanks for your response. I have been using APC products for a couple of years, so I am not quite as experienced as you are with them. I do appreciate your feedback. When APC support told me that the servers are at risk without a command file or other software, I had to react. I appreciate you speaking from experience and clarifying my concerns. I have setup the APC software to shutdown the server after being on battery for 15 minutes (most have over 45 minutes of run time).

                      I have spent some time on this, but that's because I have many other clients in the same boat. I am trying to make sure everyone is properly protected. Typing a quick post doesn't take but a couple of minutes every few days to ensure that happens, but as I said, I appreciate your concern and assistance very much so!

                      Derek

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                      • #12
                        Re: SBS Services With UPS and Backup/Restore

                        Well you're certainly doing the job the way I'd like you to do it if I hired you: Covering all the bases, making sure you have a thorough understanding of what you're implementing, weighing the options and risks, etc. Keep doing what you're doing. Hopefully, my posts were helpful in getting to the heart of the matter.

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                        • #13
                          Re: SBS Services With UPS and Backup/Restore

                          Derek, there was no need to delete your post (in reply to mine). It actually provided more clues as to what you wanted to do. As Joe has now explained, it is not necessary to shutdown all the services to allow for a graceful shutdown. If your Power Applet is configured correctly, pressing the Power Button on most modern machines will also give you a graceful shutdown.

                          If you want to check if your partitions are clean, run the following from a command prompt.
                          >fsutil dirty query c:
                          This will check the C partition. I find the easiest way to do this is just remember the FSUTIL command. After typing, I just use the help function to see what comes next.
                          >fsutil /? and it tells me what to type next. Repeat process until you have the complete syntax and then press ENTER.

                          Is your instant notification working now? We have had an issue with it since the Server Migration and would like to know if it is now working. Thanks.
                          1 1 was a racehorse.
                          2 2 was 1 2.
                          1 1 1 1 race 1 day,
                          2 2 1 1 2

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