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  • New hardware for SBS2008

    Hi,
    A customer is looking for new hardware to a SBS2008.

    Until now, we are here.
    IBM x3650 (7979KPG) 2U Rackserver
    Intel Xeon Quad Core 2 GHz
    10 GB DDR2-667 ECC Memory
    4x146 GB 15K SAS - RAID5, OS and datastorage.
    2x73 GB 15K SAS - RAID1, for Exchange logs
    Redundant PSU - Option
    ePac 3yr, 24x7x4 - Option
    Windows Small Business Server 2008 Standard.

    There is 10 users in their office, but they do have a massive mail-traffic. The server should "only" run as AD, Exchange, and file/document-share.

    Any comments, suggestions, or something else I should consider?

    I'll google about SBS2003 to SBS2008 migration now
    Best regards,
    Carsten.

  • #2
    Re: New hardware for SBS2008

    Originally posted by cs.dk View Post
    Hi,
    A customer is looking for new hardware to a SBS2008.

    Until now, we are here.
    IBM x3650 (7979KPG) 2U Rackserver
    Intel Xeon Quad Core 2 GHz
    10 GB DDR2-667 ECC Memory
    4x146 GB 15K SAS - RAID5, OS and datastorage.
    2x73 GB 15K SAS - RAID1, for Exchange logs
    Redundant PSU - Option
    ePac 3yr, 24x7x4 - Option
    Windows Small Business Server 2008 Standard.

    There is 10 users in their office, but they do have a massive mail-traffic. The server should "only" run as AD, Exchange, and file/document-share.

    Any comments, suggestions, or something else I should consider?

    I'll google about SBS2003 to SBS2008 migration now
    What exactly do you mean by massive mail traffic? That's a bit relative... for instance methinks Biggles77's 500,000 users could rightly be claimed to have a 'massive' amount of email. Just how many emails can 10 people generate in one day? A few thousand? A few ten thousand? Also, what model of Xeon is it? 7000 series? E series?

    Nonetheless, from what I know about SBS2008's hardware requirements, you should be mostly fine. The 10GB of RAM will help out and according to what I've discovered from a SBS site, SBS 2008 is sufficiently threaded to take advantage of four cores. I am, however, a bit skittish about your OS and datastorage being on a RAID5 volume. Wouldn't it be nicer to have the OS on a mirrored pair, the logs on a mirrored pair (as you have studiously already done) and then a RAID 5 for storage? Also from what I've heard, SBS 2008 beats up a disk subsystem. Get a good RAID card; 128MB, but 256 if you can manage it. I'd run some strategic perfmon counters on it from the moment it was installed so that I could keep an eye on how the disks are doing. But of course, I'm paranoid...
    Wesley David
    LinkedIn | Careers 2.0
    -------------------------------
    Microsoft Certifications: MCSE 2003 | MCSA:Messaging 2003 | MCITP:EA, SA, EST | MCTS: a'plenty | MCDST
    Vendor Neutral Certifications: CWNA
    Blog: www.TheNubbyAdmin.com || Twitter: @Nonapeptide || GTalk, Reader and Google+: [email protected] || Skype: Wesley.Nonapeptide
    Goofy kitten avatar photo from Troy Snow: flickr.com/photos/troysnow/

    Comment


    • #3
      Re: New hardware for SBS2008

      Massive mail traffic, is of course a "strange size" - They have more traffic, than I have seen on other "small" SBS-sites. (500.000 users dont use SBS )
      I can make a count, if you like. I think that their Exchange is the biggest performance-issue, on the SBS2003. Outlook shows the little yellow baloon "waiting for data from microsoft exchange", or something like that, permanently. Network-connectivity is fine, filetransfer etc. is great.

      The CPU is a Xeon E5405.

      I agree, your disk-model is better.
      (Don't like you tell that 2008 beats up the disk subsystem) I'll have to go with another server-model, with 2,5" SAS then. As it will "free up" 2 slots.
      With 3,5" it handles 6 drives, and 8 drives with 2,5"
      Forgot to mention that, the controller is an IBM ServeRAID 8K, 256MB. The question is, can I create 2x RAID1, and one RAID5 array. Need to read some documentation.

      Thank you for the tips, also about the performancecounters. - I'll download a TechNet SBS2008, and install it on a testserver tomorrow.
      Best regards,
      Carsten.

      Comment


      • #4
        Re: New hardware for SBS2008

        Originally posted by cs.dk View Post
        (500.000 users dont use SBS )
        You have a point there.


        Originally posted by cs.dk View Post
        I can make a count, if you like.
        I'll believe you, but the bean-counter in me still wants to know.


        Originally posted by cs.dk View Post
        I'll have to go with another server-model, with 2,5" SAS then. As it will "free up" 2 slots. With 3,5" it handles 6 drives, and 8 drives with 2,5"
        Unless you just make 3 RAID 1 sets and have the storage set be a pair of 300GB drives if that's enough. Is this storage going to be user storage? In which case, maybe some kind of little NAS box like a NetGear ReadyNAS NV+ or Buffalo TerraStation might be better for that.


        Originally posted by cs.dk View Post
        Forgot to mention that, the controller is an IBM ServeRAID 8K, 256MB. The question is, can I create 2x RAID1, and one RAID5 array. Need to read some documentation.
        I would be very surprised if it couldn't do multiple RAID sets like that, but of course reading the manual is always a good thing.
        Wesley David
        LinkedIn | Careers 2.0
        -------------------------------
        Microsoft Certifications: MCSE 2003 | MCSA:Messaging 2003 | MCITP:EA, SA, EST | MCTS: a'plenty | MCDST
        Vendor Neutral Certifications: CWNA
        Blog: www.TheNubbyAdmin.com || Twitter: @Nonapeptide || GTalk, Reader and Google+: [email protected] || Skype: Wesley.Nonapeptide
        Goofy kitten avatar photo from Troy Snow: flickr.com/photos/troysnow/

        Comment


        • #5
          Re: New hardware for SBS2008

          Having purchased a new server last year with SBS2008 in mind and just finding out the RAID doesn't have 2008 drivers, I am envious of your system. Not being an SBS specialist I am obvioulsy not speaking with authority but the hardware looks very nice and capable of user expansion.

          Have a look at RAID 6 as it allows for a second HDD failure before data problems however it may be out of your price range. Having had a couple of HDD failures in a RAID 5 setup, it makes you very nervous until you get the drive swaped out. (1 case was over 2 weeks).

          (With 500,000 users, SBS = Shitloads of Bloody Servers)
          1 1 was a racehorse.
          2 2 was 1 2.
          1 1 1 1 race 1 day,
          2 2 1 1 2

          Comment


          • #6
            Re: New hardware for SBS2008

            Originally posted by Nonapeptide
            I'll believe you, but the bean-counter in me still wants to know.
            Sorry to ask, but what is the easiest method to count mailflow in Exchange for 24 hours - Perfmon?

            Originally posted by Nonapeptide
            Unless you just make 3 RAID 1 sets and have the storage set be a pair of 300GB drives if that's enough. Is this storage going to be user storage? In which case, maybe some kind of little NAS box like a NetGear ReadyNAS NV+ or Buffalo TerraStation might be better for that.
            3x RAID1 sets could maybe do it to. The 300GB og 450GB disks is an option to. Me thinking
            It is for user storage, yes. They allready have a TeraStation for backup. And I really don't want the users to put files there, or even access it.


            Originally posted by Nonapeptide
            I would be very surprised if it couldn't do multiple RAID sets like that, but of course reading the manual is always a good thing.
            I'll find some documentation of the controller.
            Best regards,
            Carsten.

            Comment


            • #7
              Re: New hardware for SBS2008

              Originally posted by biggles77
              Having purchased a new server last year with SBS2008 in mind and just finding out the RAID doesn't have 2008 drivers, I am envious of your system. Not being an SBS specialist I am obvioulsy not speaking with authority but the hardware looks very nice and capable of user expansion.

              Have a look at RAID 6 as it allows for a second HDD failure before data problems however it may be out of your price range. Having had a couple of HDD failures in a RAID 5 setup, it makes you very nervous until you get the drive swaped out. (1 case was over 2 weeks).

              (With 500,000 users, SBS = Shitloads of Bloody Servers)
              Bad thing with the controller driver. Is it from a "known vendor"?

              Is this understand correct?
              RAID5 gives me (disksize) x (number of disks) - (1 disk) = Total size
              and
              RAID6 gives me (disksize) x (number of disks) - (2 disks) = Total size

              Of course there are some factors.
              Security (Disk failures, and how "easy" it is to rebuild, if there should be a failure)
              Storage space
              Performance
              And at last - Cost. 300 or 450 GB SAS drives isn't cheap. (But necessecary)
              Last edited by cs.dk; 25th November 2008, 14:01. Reason: Typos
              Best regards,
              Carsten.

              Comment


              • #8
                Re: New hardware for SBS2008

                I've done some research, but i'm still a little confused about moving the mailboxes..

                I found these documents, and will read them tonight, so i have time to focus
                http://technet.microsoft.com/en-us/l.../cc546034.aspx

                http://www.microsoft.com/downloads/d...displaylang=en

                Documents etc. can be taken from a backup, so I have no worries there.

                EDIT: I'm really not quite sure, that I should migrate that way. There is some configuration in the old server, that I don't like.

                Could Exmerge to PST be an option?
                Last edited by cs.dk; 25th November 2008, 14:12.
                Best regards,
                Carsten.

                Comment


                • #9
                  Re: New hardware for SBS2008

                  Originally posted by cs.dk View Post
                  Sorry to ask, but what is the easiest method to count mailflow in Exchange for 24 hours - Perfmon?
                  Sorry, but I'm an Exchange newbie so you'll have to ask one of our resident messaging mavens. Search the forums for the answer to any question you may have, but if you can't find anything don't be shy to start a new thread.


                  Originally posted by cs.dk View Post
                  3x RAID1 sets could maybe do it to. The 300GB og 450GB disks is an option to. Me thinking It is for user storage, yes. They allready have a TeraStation for backup. And I really don't want the users to put files there, or even access it.
                  3 RAID1 sets might just be your best bet, although the 300+GB 15K RPM SAS HDs (4 acronyms, 2 numbers, 1 abbreviation and 1 logical operator! I'm unstoppable!! ) are rather expensive. Of course, buying a different server to fit more than 6 drives would be even more expensive.


                  Originally posted by cs.dk View Post
                  Is this understand correct?
                  RAID5 gives me (disksize) x (number of disks) - (1 disk) = Total size
                  and
                  RAID6 gives me (disksize) x (number of disks) - (2 disks) = Total size
                  You're correct!


                  Originally posted by cs.dk View Post
                  Of course there are some factors.
                  Security (Disk failures, and how "easy" it is to rebuild, if there should be a failure)
                  Storage space
                  Performance
                  And at last - Cost. 300 or 450 GB SAS drives isn't cheap. (But necessecary)
                  It's relatively easy to rebuild a failed drive in a RAID set, especially if the server is hot-swap enabled. The RAID controller's documentation should tell you everything that you need to know. Storage space for a mirrored set will of course never be as much as a RAID5 can grow to. Performance for RAID 5 is slower on writes and faster on reads. Of course, a good RAID controller will minimize that slowness.


                  Originally posted by cs.dk View Post
                  I've done some research, but i'm still a little confused about moving the mailboxes..
                  Start a new thread for any Exchange or SBS woes. You'll get more responses that way.


                  Originally posted by cs.dk View Post
                  Could Exmerge to PST be an option?
                  I'm an Exchange dunce. A new thread would serve you better.
                  Wesley David
                  LinkedIn | Careers 2.0
                  -------------------------------
                  Microsoft Certifications: MCSE 2003 | MCSA:Messaging 2003 | MCITP:EA, SA, EST | MCTS: a'plenty | MCDST
                  Vendor Neutral Certifications: CWNA
                  Blog: www.TheNubbyAdmin.com || Twitter: @Nonapeptide || GTalk, Reader and Google+: [email protected] || Skype: Wesley.Nonapeptide
                  Goofy kitten avatar photo from Troy Snow: flickr.com/photos/troysnow/

                  Comment


                  • #10
                    Re: New hardware for SBS2008

                    Recieved the server yesterday.. I picked 6x146GB 15K SAS for it.

                    SBS2008 is installed, but it was neccesary to upgrade the system BIOS, and the ServeRAID Controller ROM first. Until now it runs like a charm - It is amazing fast

                    Will post more later, when I know more
                    Best regards,
                    Carsten.

                    Comment

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