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  • UK Broadband Contracts

    Can anyone see the justification for servers demanding subscribers trap themselves into long term contracts for Broadband services such as for 12 to 18 months?

    We are not expected to abide but such long term contracts for Gas, Electricity, Phone calls etc. I only know of Sky demanding 12 month contract presumably because they provide the initial installations for free or at reduced cost. But both Sky and Broadband servers could just insist we paid for the modems etc if terminating a contract before a certain period.

    Do these problems also occur in the rest of Europe and the US?

  • #2
    Re: UK Broadband Contracts

    Originally posted by GordonSweet View Post
    Phone calls etc.
    The cheaper BT packages have a 12 month term. I guess its partly because it guarantees them a minimum amount of your hard-earned, and because in the UK everyone *else* does it that way too. But still, it's a bit crap. Weak, BT, lame.
    Gareth Howells

    BSc (Hons), MBCS, MCP, MCDST, ICCE

    Any advice is given in good faith and without warranty.

    Please give reputation points if somebody has helped you.

    "For by now I could have stretched out my hand and struck you and your people with a plague that would have wiped you off the Earth." (Exodus 9:15) - I could kill you with my thumb.

    "Everything that lives and moves will be food for you." (Genesis 9:3) - For every animal you don't eat, I'm going to eat three.

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    • #3
      Re: UK Broadband Contracts

      Don't get me started on this, I had a massive row with Demon when I left them as they "forgot" to process my cancellation in time and billed me an extra month, which I never got back even though I was cut off midway through.

      I'm now on Be Unlimited and they don't have minimum term contracts I'm glad to say. Sadly their router is about as useful as a snooze button on a smoke alarm though.
      BSc, MCSA: Server 2008, MCSE, MCSA: Messaging, MCTS
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      • #4
        Re: UK Broadband Contracts

        Originally posted by cruachan View Post
        Don't get me started on this, I had a massive row with Demon when I left them as they "forgot" to process my cancellation in time and billed me an extra month, which I never got back even though I was cut off midway through.
        So take them to court? It only costs 30 and you claim that back as part of your claim... you can do it up to six years after it happened.


        Tom
        For my own and your protection, I do not provide support by private message under any circumstances. All such messages will be deleted and ignored.

        Anything you say will be misquoted and used against you

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        • #5
          Re: UK Broadband Contracts

          After their usual practice by both many servers and some Banks and Building Scieties, when I noticed Orange was charging 6 less to new custoemrs I changed contract to 12 for up to 2 Mbps, but for 18 months. A test with http://www.dslzoneuk.net/checker.php shows the lousy phones lines here to the nearest BT exchange means I am unlikely to get a faster speed than even 3 Mbps. So there is litte poit in paying for higher Mbps

          But if you look at the Orange site you will realize why I am now baffled again as to what my limits are now, because their latested tems appear to relate to those also using Orange mobiles.

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          • #6
            Re: UK Broadband Contracts

            Originally posted by GordonSweet View Post
            After their usual practice by both many servers and some Banks and Building Scieties, when I noticed Orange was charging 6 less to new custoemrs I changed contract to 12 for up to 2 Mbps, but for 18 months. A test with http://www.dslzoneuk.net/checker.php shows the lousy phones lines here to the nearest BT exchange means I am unlikely to get a faster speed than even 3 Mbps. So there is litte poit in paying for higher Mbps

            But if you look at the Orange site you will realize why I am now baffled again as to what my limits are now, because their latested tems appear to relate to those also using Orange mobiles.
            Go with Virgin Cable Broadband if you can. I'm on their 2Mbit service and guess what speed I get at all times? Yes you guessed it - 2Mbit. Also there are network upgrades coming along which mean the lowest speed I can get is 10Mbit. Guess what speed I'll get at the PC? Yes you guessed it 10Mbit.

            ADSL is, simply put, SHITE. Cable is the way.


            Tom
            For my own and your protection, I do not provide support by private message under any circumstances. All such messages will be deleted and ignored.

            Anything you say will be misquoted and used against you

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            • #7
              Re: UK Broadband Contracts

              Originally posted by Stonelaughter View Post
              ADSL is, simply put, SHITE. Cable is the way.
              Assuming, of course, that you live in the parts of the UK that are cabled.....
              Tom Jones
              MCT, MCSE (2000:Security & 2003), MCSA:Security & Messaging, MCDBA, MCDST, MCITP(EA, EMA, SA, EDA, ES, CS), MCTS, MCP, Sec+
              PhD, MSc, FIAP, MIITT
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              Ossian Ltd
              Scotland

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              • #8
                Re: UK Broadband Contracts

                Originally posted by Stonelaughter View Post
                So take them to court? It only costs 30 and you claim that back as part of your claim... you can do it up to six years after it happened.

                I'm too lazy!

                After several months of letters flying back and forth I got fed up with their corporate babble and gave up. Not worth the hassle IMO for 15 or whatever it was.
                BSc, MCSA: Server 2008, MCSE, MCSA: Messaging, MCTS
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                • #9
                  Re: UK Broadband Contracts

                  Originally posted by Stone
                  ADSL is, simply put, SHITE. Cable is the way.
                  HUH???? ADSL is a dedicated link to the exchange. If you have a 2MB connection, you shall ALWAYS have a 2MB connection to the exchange no matter how many .

                  On Cable, if you are the only user on a 2MB connection then you will get 2MB. If there are 10 users on the same cable connection you will get to share the 2MB connection so (in theory) you will each have 200KB. Of course the bandwidth may be throttled so when traffic becomes heavier (more users on the same piece of cable) then they can reduce the throttling and try and keep the speed up.

                  Cable is like Wireless but it has a solid connection and doesn't rely on radio waves.

                  Finally, it is all well and good having a high speed connection (I have ADSL2+ that delivers a 13megabit connection due to distance from the Exchange) but I can still only download at 5kb/sec (dialup speed) when I connect to msi.com. Microsoft on the other hand gives me 700MB in 10 minutes.
                  Last edited by biggles77; 18th October 2008, 19:11. Reason: Fix typo
                  1 1 was a racehorse.
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                  • #10
                    Re: UK Broadband Contracts

                    Originally posted by biggles77 View Post
                    Originally posted by Stone
                    ADSL is, simply put, SHITE. Cable is the way.
                    HUH???? ADSL is a dedicated link to the exchange. If you have a 2MB connection, you shall ALWAYS have a 2MB connection to the exchange no matter how many.
                    Errmm... in the UK we have ADSL connections to a local exchange; however they advertise "up to" 8Mb (for instance) and you very VERY rarely get more than 2. Unless you have the local exchange in your kitchen, of course. If it's more than 1km away your speed suffers horrendously... and it almost always is more than 2km away.

                    On Cable, if you are the only user on a 2MB connection then you will get 2MB. If there are 10 users on the same cable connection you will get to share the 2MB connection so (in theory) you will each have 200KB. Of course the bandwidth may be throttled so when traffic becomes heavier (more users on the same piece of cable) then they can reduce the throttling and try and keep the speed up.
                    We run a different kind of cable here in the UK - it's 1Gbit Optical to the box in the street and copper to the house; the box in the street is shared between subscribers; here in the Nottingham area you can buy anything from a 2Mbit line (which is what I have) to a 20MBit line (which my mate has). The infrastructure is such that you share the 1Gbit with your neighbours - meaning you ALWAYS get the bandwidth you pay for. ALWAYS. They're upgrading soon to be able to provide 100MBit to the house (!!!).

                    I *have* heard of the "Cable" systems in the States and elsewhere that have a poor contention ratio and therefore end up with poor bandwidth sharing; however in the UK this is not a problem because Virgin (in the past NTL and before that Diamond Cable) made sure their infrastructure was up to what they were advertising.

                    Cable is like Wireless but it has a solid connection and doesn't rely on radio waves.
                    So in what way is it like Wireless? LOL

                    Finally, it is all well and good having a high speed connection (I have ADSL2+ that delivers a 13megabit connection due to distance from the Exchange) but I can still only download at 5kb/sec (dialup speed) when I connect to msi.com. Microsoft on the other hand gives me 700MB in 10 minutes.
                    It's very handy for downloading - IF your ISP doesn't throttle this activity. Mine does as far as I know, at peak times.


                    Tom
                    For my own and your protection, I do not provide support by private message under any circumstances. All such messages will be deleted and ignored.

                    Anything you say will be misquoted and used against you

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                    • #11
                      Re: UK Broadband Contracts

                      Originally posted by Stonelaughter View Post
                      Errmm... in the UK we have ADSL connections to a local exchange; however they advertise "up to" 8Mb (for instance) and you very VERY rarely get more than 2.
                      Keep in mind that that's largely because BT have always been reluctant to replace the aging infrastructure, some of which is almost 100 years old. They have recently announced plans to completely replace the entire system, but don't expect it to happen anytime soon.

                      I'm on a 16Mbit connection, paying 2 a month more than my ISP's 8MBit option. I took that largely for the higher upload speed, but as it happens I'm able to get equivalent speeds of around 12-13 MBit.
                      Gareth Howells

                      BSc (Hons), MBCS, MCP, MCDST, ICCE

                      Any advice is given in good faith and without warranty.

                      Please give reputation points if somebody has helped you.

                      "For by now I could have stretched out my hand and struck you and your people with a plague that would have wiped you off the Earth." (Exodus 9:15) - I could kill you with my thumb.

                      "Everything that lives and moves will be food for you." (Genesis 9:3) - For every animal you don't eat, I'm going to eat three.

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                      • #12
                        Re: UK Broadband Contracts

                        xDSL graph, speed v distance from Exchange. http://www.internode.on.net/resident..._adsl/extreme/

                        Originally posted by Stone
                        So in what way is it like Wireless? LOL
                        It is a shared medium where everyone shares the one cable (the same way a WAP is used and the bandwidth shared between all the users). Even a 1Gbit cable will suffer if you have 100 users each with a 20Mbit connection. Unlike ADSL which is a dedicated connection to each user (by the phone line connection to the Exchange). Distance from the Exchange and the wire gauge used in repairs plays a factor in the connection speed but FTTN or better FTTD will eliminate or certainly deminish this problem. In parts of Europe, Korea (Seoul) and Japan, 100Mbit to the door is not uncommon.

                        An analogy would be to compare the old RJ58 Coax network (Cable) and a 10 meg switched CAT5 (ADSL) network. Which one has the potential to provide more data throughput? On the CAT5 network, every user has a 10 meg link to the switch. On the old RJ58 cable, all the users share the same medium so 10 meg divided by 50 users = less than the CAT5.
                        1 1 was a racehorse.
                        2 2 was 1 2.
                        1 1 1 1 race 1 day,
                        2 2 1 1 2

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                        • #13
                          Re: UK Broadband Contracts

                          (a) on cable in the UK, you'll NEVER find a street where there are 100 cable users; never mind on 20MBit each. Cabled areas are well serviced in general with a street box every 50 houses or less for the most part. A 20MBit connection is 27 per month on its own - people just can't afford it. I'm getting TV, phone service AND 2MBit internet for 30.

                          (b) on ADSL in the UK, we're talking (as someone said above) about copper wires installed in the late 1800s, early 1900s. They were never replaced, and they're seriously LOSSY. The street boxes are often vandalised, and the connections are old and not great. Most BT voice engineers still need to carry a Krone tool! When I say that distance from the exchange plays a big part, you really can trust me.


                          Tom
                          For my own and your protection, I do not provide support by private message under any circumstances. All such messages will be deleted and ignored.

                          Anything you say will be misquoted and used against you

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                          • #14
                            Re: UK Broadband Contracts

                            Originally posted by Stonelaughter View Post
                            copper wires installed in the late 1800s, early 1900s
                            Which Big Dave from Highway Maintenance has cut through 50 times, and repaired with sellotape and cling film.
                            Gareth Howells

                            BSc (Hons), MBCS, MCP, MCDST, ICCE

                            Any advice is given in good faith and without warranty.

                            Please give reputation points if somebody has helped you.

                            "For by now I could have stretched out my hand and struck you and your people with a plague that would have wiped you off the Earth." (Exodus 9:15) - I could kill you with my thumb.

                            "Everything that lives and moves will be food for you." (Genesis 9:3) - For every animal you don't eat, I'm going to eat three.

                            Comment


                            • #15
                              Re: UK Broadband Contracts

                              Originally posted by Stonelaughter View Post
                              ADSL is, simply put, SHITE. Cable is the way.
                              I guess optical is the way
                              Best regards,
                              Carsten.

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